wholesale auction without first taking the time and expense of
education. Novices are at risk in any market for anything. For some
reason, there seems to be a surplus of new antiquity buyers that are
willing to spend thousands of dollars without first slowing down to
learn anything.
Auctions that charge no buyer's premium typically sell "as is" with
no right of return. This is the ebay model. Auctions that charge a
15 - 25% buyers premium typically give some guarantee and a limited
right of return but you PAY for it. A buyer should expect a long term
guarantee and some form of return from a retail seller unless
something different is specified.
You and others on here expect retail and premium paid auction
privileges from ebay when you should not. eBay charges no buyer's fee
and it is unreasonable to expect retail treatment in a wholesale
venue such as ebay. With millions of auctions, the only way ebay
could police every auction and investigate every complain would be to
charge a large buyer's premium. I prefer no fee, no nothing, just
accepting old fashioned personal resposibility for your own actions.
If a buyer does not know fake from real, they should be buying from
dealers they know or from vettedsites like Vcoins.
If the time people spend whining about ebay was spent studying books
and catalogues, the fake sellers would be out of business in very
short order.
--- In Ancientartifacts@yahoogroups.com, Heathen <pearlheartgtr@...>
wrote:
>
> The Wild West nature could be fun but many unwitting novices are
taken advantage of in the tens of thousands of dollars collectively
all the time.
>
> Some may say that they might deserve it for not doing the
research on the piece or the seller. But most of the time, they don't
know any better when they see enormous feedback ratings and such.
>
> I, personally, have given up on ebay but Ernies list of sellers
actually let me know who I can rely on.
>
> --Heather
>
> wesley lau <dion6x@...> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I love the west west nature of ebay also. However, the virtual
nature of this internet also allows one to "hide" behind the screen
and so the nature of free enterprise is not the quite the same. I
would think that it is easier to sell a fake on ebay than it is to
sell the same fake at the flea market. Likewise, flame wars are
easier to start without truly having anything at risk.
>
> The logical extension of this sort of free enterprise would then be
see no evil.. I can sell anything! And to this I would comment:
Caveat Emptor!
>
> sincerely,
>
> wesley
>
> Steve Minor <relicdigar@...> wrote: hi,
>
> i have never collected antiquities, i just sell minor pieces as a
> sideline. i occasionally get something that i find exciting but it
> passes quickly; mostly i just tag them and sell them (theoretically)
> i care about fakes only in that i don't want to sell something bad
> unwittingly to a buyer. beyond that, i am totally free market and i
> love the wild west nature of ebay. there are still a few people
like
> myself that understand and can deal with free enterprise and its
good
> and bad consequences. I would love to see an internet auction with
> low fees, no reserves, no rules, no interference, just free
> competition. ebay is, or was, as close as it gets.
>
> --- In Ancientartifacts@yahoogroups.com, Gary Jensen <gjkmt1946@>
> wrote:
> >
> > Steve,
> > I certainly understand how you feel about the complications of
> collecting antiquities. It is not for the faint of heart! I gave up
> collecting several years ago and only recently regained some
> interest. 99% of my pieces have come from "reliable" sellers but I
> know there are bad pieces staring at me out of the cabinets. I have
> been trying to identify the questionable items with as many
opinions
> as I can get. One fake is one fake too many!!! Many on this site
> probably feel the same as I.
> >
>
> The only advice I can give is to buy from dealers who are
> honest ALL the time, get second opinions, and remember that honest
> people do occasionaly make mistakes!!!!
> > This site is still a great resource for both novices and
> experienced collectors as well.
> > Gary
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----
> > From: Steve <maximusopinionus@>
> > To: Ancientartifacts@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 6:38:39 AM
> > Subject: [Ancientartifacts] Re: Trocadero? sunnytampa
> >
> > --- In Ancientartifacts@ yahoogroups. com, "Steve Minor"
> <relicdigar@ ...> wrote:
> > >Hi Steve / Group.
> > I think I am now ready for the Abide With Me.. Home For The
> Bewildered.. ..
> > The list you send is the new list I downloaded from the group
last
> weekend..
> > The Seller I mentioned is antiquarica .. I have now perused this
> Blacklist umpteen times
> > but I cannot see him mentioned.. As I didn't see him mentioned on
> this latest list I
> > placed my winning bid yesterday..
> > I can see the sunnytampa that you spoke about in your earlier
> posting but I thought you
> > had mean't that Tampa was a hotbed of fakers.. and seeing that
> antiquarica' s address is
> > Tampa it rang my internal alarm bell.
> > You say you do not understand why he is on a Blacklist as most of
> his stuff is better than
> > the other blacklist stuff ???? But I thought the idea of the
> Blacklist was to highlight the
> > Fakers, not Sellers whose fakes are better than other Sellers
> fakes..
> > I am not usually this 'thick' but somewhere along the line I have
> totally lost the thread of
> > this discussion..
> > Guess I should get rid of the Antiquities and just sit here
playing
> with the buttons on my
> > Cardigan.... ...... lol.
> > Regards Steve S
> > > he is on this one. I never understood why because most of his
> stuff
> > > seems to be a bit better than most of the b lacklist stuff.
> > > http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/Ancientart ifacts/message/ 41117
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In Ancientartifacts@ yahoogroups. com, "Steve"
> > > <maximusopinionus@ > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hi Steve & Group.
> > > > As a Newbie I do try and follow the advice given.. My eBay
> > > purchases have fallen
> > > > dramatically and I seem to be spending more time following
> links
> > > posted on this group
> > > > both to view fakes and 'guaranteed' items.I also have the
> latest
> > > Fakers List (many thanks
> > > > Ramon) which has also helped steer me clear of potential
> trouble.
> > > Due to past advice I
> > > > tend to look on Trocadero as being a lot safer than eBay but
> with
> > > this latest discussion I
> > > > now feel as 'unsafe' as I do on eBay. Last night I purchased
a
> coin
> > > from a Seller called
> > > > Antiquarica who has 4000 feedback and gives a long term money
> back
> > > guarantee as to
> > > > authenticity. . Now in this latest message Steve, you mention
> Sunny
> > > Tampa .. where
> > > > antiquarica hails from.. and this Seller is NOT on the
> Blacklist..
> > > Now I am standing here
> > > > not knowing if I am on my 'head or my elbow'. HELP !!
> > > > Regards Steve S..--- In Ancientartifacts@ yahoogroups.
> com, "Steve
> > > Minor"
> > > > <relicdigar@ > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I decided to do a quick, highly scientific survey of
> Trocadero.I
> > > > > searched for phallic, Roman, and Viking and somewhat
randomly
> > > chose a
> > > > > page and object and these are the jewels I found:
> > > > >
> > > http://www.trocader o.com/02016/ item502016store.
> html#itemfaganar ms/item
> > > > > s/745125/item745125 store.html# item
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > http://www.trocader o.com/glitzqueen /items/502016/
> item502016store. html#
> > > > > item
> > > > >
> > > > > http://www.trocader o.com/archeology /items/754472/
> item754472. html
> > > > >
> > > > > The Fagan arms Viking iron items sure do look like the same
> iron
> > > I
> > > > > get from Bulgaria and Germany and I certainly don't call it
> > > Viking.
> > > > > I also see Sunny Tampa on Trocadero. You all can bet on 95%
> of
> > > the
> > > > > merch on here being real; I will not. Go search "fibula"
> > > or "phallic"
> > > > > and show me the 95% real ones on there.
> > > > >
> > > > > The only protection against buying fakes is to know the
> material
> > > or
> > > > > have a first person relationship with a dealer that
> guarantees
> > > the
> > > > > merchandise. If you depend on a third person entity, like
the
> > > > > Trocadero management or eBay's Safe Harbor, you are in a
very
> > > weak
> > > > > position.
> > > > >
> > > > > And to continously say that 90 - 95% of the antiquities on
> eBay
> > > are
> > > > > fake is just ridiculous. At this point in time, at least
99%
> look
> > > > > fake to me.
> > > > >
> > > > > I will be doing the photobucket thing again in a couple of
> weeks.
> > > > > Hopefully about 125 items if I have the energy. I have a
few
> > > hundred
> > > > > pieces of insignia to get posted and then I will turn my
> > > attention to
> > > > > the artifacts again.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In Ancientartifacts@ yahoogroups. com, "Brett"
<mavebc@>
> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > First of all D_ _ _ - I ain't your "son" - Second - I
sell
> on
> > > both
> > > > > > and I know the difference.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --- In Ancientartifacts@ yahoogroups. com, "Steve Minor"
> > > > > > <relicdigar@ > wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Son,
> > > > > > > I bet I have much more of a clue than you.
> > > > > > > I have been a member of Trocadero a couple of times and
> on
> > > ebay
> > > > > > since
> > > > > > > the first year. Misrepresentations are common all over
> > > Trocadero
> > > > > as
> > > > > > > they are anywhere eles but go ahead and jump on
something
> > > just
> > > > > > > because it posted there. good luck.
> > > > > > > SGM
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --- In Ancientartifacts@ yahoogroups. com, "Brett"
> <mavebc@>
> > > wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > To compare Trocadero and ebay means you have no clue.
> Where
> > > > > > > probably
> > > > > > > > upwards of 80% of ebay items can be fake or
> reproduction,
> > > 95%
> > > > > of
> > > > > > > > trocadero is a safe bet.
> > > > > > > > Brett
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > --- In Ancientartifacts@ yahoogroups. com, "Steve
> Minor"
> > > > > > > > <relicdigar@ > wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Trocadero is no safer than any other site. There
are
> a
> > > lot of
> > > > > > > > > Trocadero dealers on here that will vouch for
> Trocadero
> > > but
> > > > > > there
> > > > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > > as much misreresentation on there in the categories
I
> am
> > > > > > familiar
> > > > > > > > > with as on eBay or antwhere else.
> > > > > > > > > I have reported obvious fakes to the site and never
> got
> > > an
> > > > > > answer
> > > > > > > > or
> > > > > > > > > result.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > --- In Ancientartifacts@ yahoogroups.
com, "niuboy08"
> > > > > <niuboy08@>
> > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > I'm newer to collecting, and I recently
discovered
> > > > > > Trocadero.
> > > > > > > I
> > > > > > > > > > thaught that it would be a more reliable site
> online in
> > > > > > finding
> > > > > > > > > > authentic pieces than that of ebay. And, I
noticed
> > > one
> > > > > item
> > > > > > > > which
> > > > > > > > > has
> > > > > > > > > > been classified as fake from collector-antiquiti
> es.com
> > > and
> > > > > I
> > > > > > > was
> > > > > > > > > > wondering if Trocadero polices itself, or if its
> more
> > > or
> > > > > less
> > > > > > > > like
> > > > > > > > > ebay?
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Here is the link to the item:
> > > http://tinyurl. com/2fgdlc
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > and to the collector-antiquite s page with the
same
> item
> > > (I
> > > > > > > think
> > > > > > > > > even
> > > > > > > > > > same picture): http://www.collecto r-
> > > antiquities. com/353/
> > > > > > > > > > http://tinyurl. com/28l9at
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > > > > > > Albert
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> __________________________________________________________
> ______________
> > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
> > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> "A wasted youth is better by far than a wise and productive old
age......And if the thrill is gone, then it's time to TAKE IT BACK!!!"
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
>
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